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Thread: Front Camber

  1. #11
    VXRacing ahead spartan35025's Avatar
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    Doing a little more research and found a thread on the PVG Forums where the OP was asking about geometry setup on an Astra with KW v3 suspension.
    I was interested to read that Bo Nielson had posted, as personally given his experience with the Astra H, I value his opinion.

    Hopefully Bo doesn't mind me reposting his comments:
    "For road driving I would have about -1 camber on all 4 wheels with a minimum amount of toe in on both front and rear to make it very stable and not eat tyres."

    I have always ran 0° degrees toe and haven't noticed any problems with the Astra's stability at speed, so I'll probably leave that alone.
    However I think I've decided on setting the camber at -1°00' to -1°15' for now and seeing how that feels.


    Cheers,
    Mike
    Last edited by spartan35025; 29th October 2014 at 12:14 AM.
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  2. #12
    The Red Baron... Deathace's Avatar
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    I have just got back from having 4 wheel alignment and the rears were not touched as he said it would be negligible so why bother for the moment.



    Feels good on the road and the extra left camber is to cater for the roads around here having more left camber, for the track it shouldn't affect it too much for the odd day. If I wanted to put the car full track then I will go back and get it setup differently.

    Russ

  3. #13
    VXR enough VEE EX AR's Avatar
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    Running -2.5° on mine for track and fast road. Feels great with no problems. Not a daily so not worrying about tyre wear.



    WG Motorworks Stage 4+, Owens hta turbo, Piper Cams, Lightened flywheel, Quaife LSD ,356mm K Sports ,KW clubsports, Safety Devices cage, Sparco buckets, Aircon delete, 18in TD's, R888s.

  4. #14
    VXRacing ahead spartan35025's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deathace View Post
    I have just got back from having 4 wheel alignment and the rears were not touched as he said it would be negligible so why bother for the moment.
    Feels good on the road and the extra left camber is to cater for the roads around here having more left camber, for the track it shouldn't affect it too much for the odd day. If I wanted to put the car full track then I will go back and get it setup differently.

    Russ
    Thanks for the info Russ. Looks very similar to the setup I was running before I decided to try and make things better and instead made them worse
    Was the 0°03' toe in your idea or theirs? Bo commented that a minimal amount of toe in was a good idea, however what I've read suggests that a little toe in is good for straight line stability and a little toe out is better for corning. As I've never had any problems with stability at speed (until now), I would have thought toe out would have been recommended...

    Anyhow, enjoy the set up! I'm sure KW v3 suspension must be pretty impressive

    Quote Originally Posted by VEE EX AR View Post
    Running -2.5° on mine for track and fast road. Feels great with no problems. Not a daily so not worrying about tyre wear.
    Cheers VEE EX AR, that's interesting as you're running the same springs & dampers as me. Personally at -2°00' I find the turn in very quick, but a little unstable mid corner. Of course it's all personal preference, though the fact that you're running R888's might have something to do with it. I read that track tyres have an advisory camber requirement of -1°30' to -3°00'. So in that case, your camber angle would be about spot on.


    Hmm... a day and a half left to decide. Decisions, decisions
    Mike
    [FONT="Tahoma"]Arden Blue Astra : Gone
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  5. #15
    VXR enough VEE EX AR's Avatar
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    I had to run camber with the Dap race spec springs to stop the tyres catching the arches as they do sit very low. So I thought I may as well get it set up properly.
    WG Motorworks Stage 4+, Owens hta turbo, Piper Cams, Lightened flywheel, Quaife LSD ,356mm K Sports ,KW clubsports, Safety Devices cage, Sparco buckets, Aircon delete, 18in TD's, R888s.

  6. #16
    The Red Baron... Deathace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spartan35025 View Post
    Thanks for the info Russ. Looks very similar to the setup I was running before I decided to try and make things better and instead made them worse
    Was the 0°03' toe in your idea or theirs? Bo commented that a minimal amount of toe in was a good idea, however what I've read suggests that a little toe in is good for straight line stability and a little toe out is better for corning. As I've never had any problems with stability at speed (until now), I would have thought toe out would have been recommended...

    Anyhow, enjoy the set up! I'm sure KW v3 suspension must be pretty impressive

    Hmm... a day and a half left to decide. Decisions, decisions
    Mike
    I went by the person who was setting it all up, he does it day in day out and as the place I went to was a recommendation from courts (being I live not far) they see a lot of astras and of the options available he determined the settings it ended up with, he was a good bloke and explained to me as he was doing each part what he was doing and how each part works so I felt comfortable letting him do what he had to do.

    I will be taking the wife's car to him in a couple of weeks as that has just had Eibach pro lines fitted and the Tigra is renowned for needing camber adjustment when lowered but were just letting it settle for the next couple of weeks.

    I like the KW setup it is a very good package and the feedback you get from the car now is great. It is not one of those can't be without mods as you don't really miss what you never had but since putting them on they really are worth the money to me.

    Russ

  7. #17
    VXRacing ahead spartan35025's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VEE EX AR View Post
    I had to run camber with the Dap race spec springs to stop the tyres catching the arches as they do sit very low. So I thought I may as well get it set up properly.
    Ah ok. I have the DAP 'road' springs so probably not as much of a problem for me. I think the only time I've caught the arches so far was when I hit a massive pothole in the dark and wrote off a damper. But that was a little exceptional

    Quote Originally Posted by Deathace View Post
    I went by the person who was setting it all up, he does it day in day out and as the place I went to was a recommendation from courts (being I live not far) they see a lot of astras and of the options available he determined the settings it ended up with, he was a good bloke and explained to me as he was doing each part what he was doing and how each part works so I felt comfortable letting him do what he had to do.

    I will be taking the wife's car to him in a couple of weeks as that has just had Eibach pro lines fitted and the Tigra is renowned for needing camber adjustment when lowered but were just letting it settle for the next couple of weeks.

    I like the KW setup it is a very good package and the feedback you get from the car now is great. It is not one of those can't be without mods as you don't really miss what you never had but since putting them on they really are worth the money to me.

    Russ
    I've always gotten the impression that KW suspension was the dog's danglies. I just never bothered looking at prices as I thought it would cost much more than springs and dampers and to date I haven't done any track days (as I'm too worried about damaging my pride & joy). Either way I am happy with the suspension I have.

    It's always good when you can feel confident about the people working on your car; especially as that's quite a rarity these days!
    I'm not sure how KW v3 compares to DAP / Bilstein B8s in terms of ride height and stiffness etc, however I used to use -1°30' camber which is only a few minutes off the settings you now have, so I was probably about right. I'm just not sure whether to go back to -1°30' again or a little closer to Bo's advice and try -1°15'. I might leave it up to the workshop manager at Revolution to decide

    I'm in for alignment this Friday, but I'd still be interested to see how the set up the Tigra compares to your Astra if you don't mind once it's all sorted.


    Cheers,
    Mike
    Last edited by spartan35025; 30th October 2014 at 11:54 AM.
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  8. #18
    The Red Baron... Deathace's Avatar
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    Mike,

    I will post up the pic of the print out when I get the wife's sorted, I already had the camber bolts fitted when courts fitted the eibachs so that cuts down a bit of time messing about when getting it set up for her. I think it will boil down to what you specifically want the car to do, I will have some more seat time in it over the next few days so can gauge a bit more but initial feel on what mine is set to is quite nice. He put in the settings (modified) for -1º30 but once it had settled down and he adjusted the toe it took it back a bit but they said I could take it back any time to get it tweaked if I felt there were any problems.

    I got my KW V3's supplied and fitted with an adjustment to the rarb (5 mins work) for £1567 which I thought was really good considering a lot of places sell the KW kit for £1470 retail anyway so for the extra £97 it was all fitted up and then the £48 for front alignment. There are cheaper solutions if you go with bilstein etc but it serves me the purpose I need and that was to be able to use my wheels and track the car without worry.

    Russ
    Last edited by Deathace; 30th October 2014 at 02:22 PM.

  9. #19
    VXRacing ahead spartan35025's Avatar
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    Thanks Russ, as I say it will be interesting to see how it compares.

    My aim is to get the best cornering grip I can from the suspension set up I have. I don't believe the amount of camber I'm trying will cause much tyre wear, so that's not really a factor. With my current setup I feel that straight line stability and mid corner grip have been negatively effected. I also can't feel the diff engaging as much as it used to and straight line torque steer has been introduced when the ground is wet. Hence my thinking that I now have too much negative camber. Ultimately it is a personal choice. I just thought I'd try and get an idea of what other people are running to see if I'm in the ball park.


    Mike
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  10. #20
    VXRed blooded grantvxr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deathace View Post
    I went by the person who was setting it all up, he does it day in day out and as the place I went to was a recommendation from courts (being I live not far) they see a lot of astras and of the options available he determined the settings it ended up with, he was a good bloke and explained to me as he was doing each part what he was doing and how each part works so I felt comfortable letting him do what he had to do.

    I will be taking the wife's car to him in a couple of weeks as that has just had Eibach pro lines fitted and the Tigra is renowned for needing camber adjustment when lowered but were just letting it settle for the next couple of weeks.

    I like the KW setup it is a very good package and the feedback you get from the car now is great. It is not one of those can't be without mods as you don't really miss what you never had but since putting them on they really are worth the money to me.

    Russ
    Where abouts did you go get the work done bud. I'm fitting camber bolts, front polybushes including castor correction bushes and new front tyres soon, so need it set up well as our tracking gears work is a bit lame!!

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